update: my employee makes off-color jokes

by Alison Green on December 8, 2022

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

Remember the letter-writer whose employee was making off-color jokes? Here’s the update.

Thanks for publishing my letter. I had my review meeting with Fergus a few days after it was published and used a script very similar to the one you described. I also approached it in a fairly low-key way rather than thinking of it as disciplining. As I expected, he was very receptive to the feedback, and as soon as I brought it up, he knew what I was talking about. I explained that there was always a chance someone might overhear something like that and not realise it’s a joke, but also that more simply it just reflected badly on him, which I didn’t want for him. I also acknowledged that Martin was the one to make the first joke about drug references, but that Martin isn’t generally someone to emulate anyway.

Fergus took it all on board and wasn’t resistant to the feedback at all. We talked about how joking around at work isn’t the same as joking around with your friends, even in a fairly casual atmosphere like our office. He did briefly bring up the idea that being close to the line was part of the joke, but I made it clear that at work that line is much further back. He agreed and said he’d be more careful with his jokes and comments in the future.

And he has been! There was once incident where someone brought a delivery to his desk and there was some brief joking around the idea that it might be sex toys or something, I piped up with a “guys…”, Fergus clocked it immediately and said “sorry!” and that was that (and the worst of the joking had come from the other staff member, anyway).

The comments on the original post were really helpful, especially from some people who had been on the other end of feedback like this and how it opened their eyes a bit. A few people felt that I should have been calling Martin up on his joke as well, and not singling out Fergus. However I don’t manage Martin and really wouldn’t have the standing to bring it up with him – my organization has a pretty flat structure and Martin and I are about equal in the hierarchy. Plus he’s much older than Fergus and has been in the workforce significantly longer (and been at my company about a year longer than me), and he is NOT the type to take feedback on the taste level of his humour particularly well. So he can keep making whatever impression he wants, I’m not going to make that one my problem!

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    1. Falling Diphthong*

      I really like the detail about the line being a lot farther back at work. Context matters! And sometimes people need that explained.

      1. bt;dt*

        Yes, that was a great explanation! I can be socially clueless especially in regards to work norms, I think OP handled this very kindly and professionally.

      3. Danish*

        Yes, same. It helps him understand the problem without necessarily making it like, “listen, you and I are cool with fun jokes, but work is for squares!” Us vs them. Or make him wonder why his jokes were off the table when it’s a jokey office. Work can be fun! Even a irreverent! But yeah the line is way back there, at work, if you’re looking to toe it.

  3. Justin*

    Glad he listened! I had a coworker like that, and he also listened once I brought it up. You never know if they will or not until you do.

  7. Not Tom, Just Petty*

    The other guy said something, Fergus began to reply…you shut it down. Really great update. I am sure in the future, he pay this advice forward, “my early manager gave me great guidance.”

  8. Louisiana Purchase*

    “However I don’t manage Martin and really wouldn’t have the standing to bring it up with him – my organization has a pretty flat structure and Martin and I are about equal in the hierarchy.”

    In these situations, if Martin’s jokes bother you, you bring them up to his supervisor.

    “Plus he’s much older than Fergus and has been in the workforce significantly longer (and been at my company about a year longer than me),”

    Age and tenure are not relevant. For anyone in this situation, if the joke is offensive to you, bring it up to Martin’s manager regardless of Martin’s age and seniority.

    “and he is NOT the type to take feedback on the taste level of his humour particularly well.”

    That’s his manager’s problem to deal with.

    1. allathian*

      Absolutely this. I do understand why the LW didn’t say anything to Martin, but that doesn’t mean they can’t talk to Martin’s boss.

      That said, if the LW and Martin are more or less peers, it should be fine to say that Martin’s jokes bother them personally “please don’t use that language around me” even if they don’t have the standing to give corrective feedback in the same way as they can to a direct report. It’s more than likely that if the LW approaches Martin’s manager, the first thing they’ll ask is “have you talked to Martin about this?”

    2. a_manager*

      I would add that if Martin’s jokes are sexual or derogatory toward a protected class, the writer has a responsibility as a manager to address it, whether they manage Martin or now.

  10. Generic+Name*

    This is so encouraging to read. Too often feedback of this nature is met with screeches of, “ThEy JuSt CaN’t TaKe A jOkE!”

  11. Database+Developer+Dude*

    I was so with the LW until they decided not to say anything to Martin. It creates the impression that others can get away with what Fergus has been told is unacceptable……and undermines the message.

    1. That_guy*

      I disagree; to me it comes across more that the OP is picking their battles. They know that it is outside their scope to police Martin’s behavior, so they focused their energy where it would be more effective.

    2. Gracely*

      Sometimes it’s just not worth using up the capital it takes to do that, and it’s possible LW knows that Martin’s boss won’t do anything–or, if the org is super flat as they suggested, it might feel like too much of an escalation. It’s really not LW’s job to manage Martin, and we shouldn’t expect them to have to take that on if they’re not comfortable with it.

  12. Bill and Heather's Excellent Adventure*

    I love a happy ending. Well done to the letter writer and I’m glad Fergus took the feedback on board.

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