updates: employees are cuddling in staff meetings, unvaccinated new hire, and more by Alison Green on December 4, 2024 It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. Here are five updates from past letter-writers. There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day. 1. My 2 dating employees are cuddling in staff meetings Here’s an update on this one: initially one member of the couple was very reasonable after I talked to them, using very similar language to your suggestions (honestly, you confirmed my instincts about how to address it and gave me some concrete phrasing!). The other one said PDA was something she enjoyed doing at work but agreed to stop. The PDA did mostly stop, but it was obvious that one person was trying to pressure the other into going back to it. After a few months, the person who had been initiating more PDA began to express frustration with regular parts of her job (e.g. speaking to customers, working evenings) and let it impact her customer service. Any time anyone attempted to discuss this with her or seek solutions, she would bring up the fact that I had told her and her partner to stop kissing and cuddling in the store as evidence that management was picking on her. During this time, two straight, cis people started dating and had a similar setting of PDA expectations, so this was a tough argument for her to lean on. She quit about six months later after she tried to secretly record her performance review (in a two-party consent state) but her partner still works at the store very happily. I think I had a sense that “no PDA at work” would be an issue for this particular person, which is why I wrote in. One commenter wrote, “It’s kind of cute to see baby queers having the same struggles that I’ve seen baby straights have at work” which was also the perspective I was coming from. I myself am queer and (although queer people are not exempt from transphobia!) was trying to help these two navigate melding their first job and first relationship professionally, with a personal understanding of how LGBTQ folks are often hyper-visible, especially with regards to PDA — and also knowing that the amount of PDA from this couple was not acceptable for our workplace. Thanks for your advice! 2. Should I tell an employee that the new hire sitting right across from him all day is unvaccinated? I wrote in a couple of years ago with a dilemma about how to handle having privileged info on COVID vaccination status and medical vulnerability status of employees and how to handle it. It was good to see your response and the discussion in the comments, because it confirmed for me that it was a tough call to make because of “break the law but reduce infection risk” vs “follow the law but maybe put vulnerable people at risk” considerations meant there was no obvious one best answer. The update is not exciting, but in this case, that’s a good thing. I decided to not say anything directly to either of the employees in question, upholding the confidentiality requirements of my role at work. It helped (e.g., allowed me to sleep at night) to have seen the advice, comments about how it’s up to each of us to take reasonable precautions as we see fit and that the employee with the medically vulnerable family member was able to choose to mask up (out of caution, assuming anyone could be unvaccinated or coming down with something) or request a change in workstation, if they felt it was necessary. I also let managers know that I’d help with approval of new workstations, etc. if they had employees requesting to move to create more social distancing. Since it was October, I wound up issuing general reminders to ALL employees about sensible precautions to prevent disease spread to ALL employees, things like frequent hand washing, wearing masks if you might have been exposed to something, covering nose and mouth if sneezing, coughing, noting that updated flu and COVID-19 vaccines are available free of charge at local pharmacies, etc. etc. I posted one of those “stop the spread” notices in a few places as a reminder. The good news: as far as I know, no one spread COVID to anyone at work or beyond (though one person was out with it after catching it at a music festival) The two coworkers wound up having a good, collaborative work relationship after they got to know each other and said goodbye with tears in their eyes when the employee with the vulnerable family member recently left, moving away due to a spouse’s new job. And the family member’s health situation is much better, still higher risk for complications if they catch something, but they’re no longer facing health crisis after health crisis. Reading my question again was a good reminder for me refresh those “Stop the Spread” notices, reminders again for the new flu season, and to keep in mind that anyone could have a vulnerable family member or be unvaccinated, and to act accordingly, schedule my own vaccines, boosters, etc. Oh, and I’m still the work-place safety nerd, reminding people to wear eye protection, safety gloves and putting away knives, scissors, open box cutters I come across laying around. 3. My assistant stands when women come in (#4 at the link) As many of the commenters suggested, my assistant stands when it is someone who is higher up on the organizational chart/”superior officers.” That makes sense, and isn’t an issue in my organization. I don’t need to change it or address it in any way. A positive update: the vibe in the office had seemed overly formal. I think that may have had more to do with my predecessor and her interactions with the executive assistant, than the assistant himself. I’m much less formal and generally chatty. He seems to be greatly appreciative of that and appears less stressed, and the office feels different. I’d been concerned about some performance issues, and since we’ve made this transition, they have gone away. He is an enormous help, we’ve been working together on communication styles, and generally the vibe is better. I’ve only been in this promotion for a month, and some outside factors made it much more hectic. He has been amazing at juggling the tasks and keeping me on track. As an example, he just popped in with a family member who he had lunch with, to introduce them. He’s worked for us for five years and never done that. Really glad to have a more welcoming feeling in our office. 4. My boss suggested I work from home while still taking a sick day (#3 at the link) I wrote to you back in 2023 about being told to take a sick day if I wanted to WFH. I said in the initial question that it was pretty low-stakes but I was curious if her suggestion violated any laws. I realized this was just the tip of the iceberg — I wrote in about my manager’s suggestion because I was worried about the really toxic behavior I’d seen from leadership, including my manager: bullying, insults, cruel gossip, you name it. I also finally realized that, while my workload had been unsustainable for years, and I had been asking for help with that for years, it was never going to happen. My big takeaway was that the entire handbasket’s infernal journey was accelerating, and that I needed to get out. I had been applying here and there, but I got serious about it (when I had the energy thanks to overwork and constant “emergencies”). In May, a little more than a year after I wrote to you, I read a job posting and said, “They’re looking for me!” and I was right. I started my new job in September. It’s amazing so far, my team is great, and I’m able to do work I enjoy with a realistic workload. My job also enabled us to move to a new area, which we’ve wanted to do for a few years. As for my former office, it’s getting worse by the day. The worst of the Mean Girl clique has been telling her team (about a third of my workload went over to them and promptly overwhelmed them, even distributed across 10 people) that I “screwed over the office” by leaving. I also suspect that she’s the person who told my old grandboss that I had deleted my handover files (I did not), resulting in an accusation and vague threats about getting IT to “figure out what really happened”. Thank you so much for everything you do. Even though you didn’t tell me “your boss sucks and isn’t going to change,” once I realized that in fact, my boss and workplace sucked, the next inevitable piece was “and nothing is going to change,” so I did the smart thing and got out. 5. Are offers to stay in touch with old coworkers really sincere? You answered my question back in 2016 about staying in touch with old coworkers. My update is that it was my old boss who reached out first with a party invite, a few months after I’d left. I attended and it was lovely to see everyone again. About six months later there was another great party to catch-up at. After those two parties, I became really busy with life things and didn’t end up reaching out to anyone for coffee. But I still occasionally email my old boss and colleagues. I thought of your advice again recently when leaving a job and when my boss and coworkers from there reached out I took their offers with sincerity and met up with them again. You may also like:my 2 dating employees are cuddling in staff meetingsunvaccinated employees are complaining about a $100 bonus for getting vaccinatedI desperately need breaks between my back-to-back meetings { 44 comments }
update: I organize orgies — can I talk about it in my job hunt? by Alison Green on December 4, 2024 It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day. Remember the letter-writer who organized orgies and wanted to know if they could talk about it in their job hunt? Here’s the update. When I wrote in to you about work for retired orgynizers, I was mostly writing out of shame. There had been a ton of fun, friendship, and adventure in orgynizing. But I also thought that it made me sort of marked forever as some class of “candidate too gross, too weird” to employers. Reading the comments was whiplash. One type was certain that I would engage in further nefarious deeds in the workplace, like not writing my experience from that business as ORGY MAKERS R US, LEAD ORGYNIZER on my resume. Or some other line of thinking about how my character was irreparably damaged from my time buying lube in bulk. There were also a ton of people who said things along the lines of “oh, yep, I’ve needed to be cautious about things in a resume before.” People were pointing out my obvious admin and people skills. [And you know what? You were right! I DO have great administrative and people skills! Some thought it was funny, people conducted sex ed for adults in the comments (“what do they do at orgies? why does it take a weekend?”] I read all the comments, and you guys were great. Thank you, too, to the commenter who came up with “orgynizer.” That is a genius portmanteau. May there always be room in the office fridge for your lunch, may the good parking spot open up before you. What did I do with your advice? I decided fuck ’em. The global point of no return from climate change is 2-26 years away. What is the point of worrying about if every interviewer will like my resume? Universal appeal isn’t something we get. I took my skills in finding very discreet AirBnBs and herding people with cat ears, and now I do an analog letterpress business’s marketing and administration. Fun! Weird! Lots of old white men in Meaningful hats! Not fracking! Pays the bills! Great. I also teach people how to grow legal psychedelic plants, and am working on a slime mold that I can use for data visualization projects. Which is all to say, don’t let the bastards grind you down. There are so many good paths through life. As long as you’re not hurting anyone, picking a strange but reliable career path is a totally neutral, or even good, thing to do. Warmly, Former Orgynizer, Retired with Honors P.S. A common question that came up in the comments was if the adult weekends were something I was doing as a volunteer/my hobby. Nope! Formal business. I set up an LLC for that business and paid taxes under that designation. You may also like:I organize orgies -- can I talk about it in my job hunt?friend drama may collide with job huntI wrote a Glassdoor review and the employer is losing their minds { 232 comments }
my assistant doesn’t know how to prioritize by Alison Green on December 4, 2024 A reader writes: My team recently hired a part-time assistant, Jane, to help with my work. The problem I’m running into is that Jane either doesn’t know how to prioritize or doesn’t understand that certain things need to be prioritized even if I explicitly tell her “this task needs to be completed before you do anything else.” She continues doing tasks that she finds enjoyable without working on items that have hard deadlines. For example, I asked her four weeks in advance to pack up a big shipment by the end of month – she had plenty of time and she’s done it successfully before – and yet when I asked her what was going on a week before the shipment was due? She hadn’t gotten to it yet. She had spent three weeks working on other tasks instead, like emailing leads. With such a short amount of time left for the shipment, the rest of us had to pitch in to help complete the task, when really she could have done it by herself if she had started earlier. I tend to be a person who prioritizes any tasks with a deadline – even if the deadline is two months later just so it’s done and dusted. I get that there are some people who function very differently, and that’s fine within reason! I don’t want to dump my work style on her by prioritizing for her, but I’m at a loss for how to better manage completion of the tasks I assign to her. Help? I answer this question over at Inc. today, where I’m revisiting letters that have been buried in the archives here from years ago (and sometimes updating/expanding my answers to them). You can read it here. You may also like:my coworker wants me to do all the work he sends me ASAP, even when I have higher prioritieshow do I ask the CEO if I can "borrow" his assistant for my projects?am I really supposed to bug my coworkers to get my projects handled? { 86 comments }
update: my company secretly gives parents thousands of extra dollars in benefits by Alison Green on December 4, 2024 It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day. Remember the letter-writer who found out their company secretly gives parents thousands of extra dollars in benefits? Here’s the update. Thanks to you and everyone in the comments for, before anything else, validating my opinions that this is bananas! A few notes/answers: The child-free staff obviously noticed a lot of these things! Most of them, even! We just didn’t assume “our organization’s supervisors are running a secret benefits club” because that would be insane, right?!? Ha. To give some examples, most colleagues with kids made one weekly appearance in the office during the summer, so we attributed the extra remote days to their managers being nice, not a formal policy exemption. We’d see coworkers attend events as guests (and loved when they believed in our events enough to bring their families!) but we didn’t know they still got comp time. Honestly, the only people who took 100% advantage of every perk offered, no questions asked, were independently known to be … asshats. My favorite example: my boss is universally loathed in the office — they’re the kind of person who emails you projects on Saturday night, texts you about it on Sunday morning, then yells at you if it’s not done Monday morning before they hand me all their work to leave the office at 2 pm. The office has lovingly nicknamed them “NWC” for “No White Clothes” because you’ll never see them in the office between Memorial Day and Labor Day. Someone in the comments questioned how the child-free managers felt about this and it helped me realize that every single person in the C-suite and director level had kids, as did probably two-thirds of the manager level. Most of the managers who didn’t have kids living with them were older empty-nesters who did have kids under their roof at one point, too. I honestly couldn’t think of a single parent who didn’t report to another parent. But I doubt that had anything to do with these policies (*rolls eyes as high as possible*). I should say, that didn’t impact who did or didn’t get promoted into certain roles: parents and non-parents alike were deservedly hired or promoted from within; it did obviously impact which supervisor was assigned to which person. Yes, apparently if you have your first child while working there, you then get told about the “expanded benefits packages to accommodate your new family.” It seems the colleagues are so pleasantly surprised at all the benefits they aren’t retroactively angry (or maybe they are and feel it’s better to keep the secret). We do have a small, understaffed HR department. One person who is basically the liaison between us and a PEO for benefits and payroll, and a director who mostly does interviews and handles complaints. Both parents. To try and fix this (especially because I had been regularly interviewing to leave and didn’t want to do it alone in the event I got a new job and left it behind), I spoke to some trusted colleagues, one a parent and two child-free. The colleague who was a parent, I also learned, had joined as a parent and was not given a big “don’t tell the others” speech, it was just suggested they have discretion around benefits so we don’t “let money get in the way of teamwork.” The two child-free colleagues had no idea about this and were enraged. The four of us met and, the Monday after your answer, put together some language and emailed our HR department and managers to outline that we knew about the benefits differences and were 100% prepared to publicly share with the full organization and an employment lawyer if they did not work to balance out the benefits, or at least publicize the differences so non-parents can choose whether or not they want to work here. I got a response that they’d “be looking into it” and suddenly a number of directors and managers (including my boss), the C-suite, HR, and some board members were meeting for hours at a time that week. That Friday, an email went out that basically said benefits would be changing to “match the changing needs of our organization.” However, it didn’t acknowledge previous differences. Generally it meant that non-parents got the extra time off, comp days are only given if you complete a volunteer shift, and we would have a universal in-office day of Wednesday during the summers, but be remote the other four days. However, some benefits weren’t changing: you were still only eligible for family gym memberships if you had kids (“there is no couples membership at Organization,” so non-families were just SOL), leaving early without taking PTO was only for school pickups, and no announced change to our retirement benefits. If not happy with the response (we weren’t!), my colleagues and I were planning to tell everyone, but we didn’t even have to. Sadly I missed this while out of town for a wedding, but apparently a parent in the office got this email just before entering a Zoom. He didn’t realize there were some non-parents already logged on and said out loud to another parent something along the lines of “Did anyone else see this? I don’t get it, it’s just our benefits but now I have to be in on Wednesdays!” Cue the questions, cue the firestorm, cue everyone being told to log off and go home at noon on a Friday. Since then, multiple people have quit out of pure rage (incluidng some parents who were also told to have discretion and were disgusted with the org), the C-level exec who originally spearheaded these benefits resigned, and all the non-parents have collectively agreed to refuse to go in the office until everything is more equal. Almost every benefit that was given to parents will now be offered org-wide (they are even creating a couples’ gym membership) but, interestingly, they have not touched the one thing that seemed to rile up the comments section the most: retirement matching! Apparently, because families with kids spend more money, and the changing economy means more young adults need financial support from their parents in their 20’s, parents need more money in retirement to make up for it. This is a sticking point the non-parents are really fighting against, and the org seems to be adamant they won’t budge on. Lucky for me, the reason I’m not joining them in that good fight is that I’m writing this having submitted my two weeks. Found an interesting new job (and used your advice on interviews and in negotiations) and submitted my notice. There was still some drama: My aforementioned asshat boss NWC responded by taking multiple projects away from my fellow non-parents, saying “they can’t do it while on their remote strike” and assigning them to me (~120 hours of group work to be done alone in 10 working days). Extra lucky for me, I have a family member and a college friend who are both employment lawyers; they helped me craft an email saying that because I’ve been assigned an unreasonable amount of work on an impossible timeline after being a whistleblower for the benefits issue, I could and would sue for retaliation. An hour later I got a call from HR letting me know that my work had been reassigned and that once I’d finished editing an exit doc for my successor, I could log off permanently and still be paid for the full notice period and get my vacation payouts. Currently basking in the glow of paid funemployment. (When I’m done writing this, my wife and I are going to get drinks and lunch! At 2 in the afternoon! On a Tuesday!) Thanks again to the comments for the suggestions and making me feel less like a bewildered baboon, and to you for your sage advice with this question and so many others! I’m aware of my privilege in having understanding colleagues and literally being able to text two employment lawyers and get good, pro bono advice within a day. Not everyone has that, so thank you for providing the resource. You may also like:my company secretly gives parents thousands of extra dollars in benefitsam I too generous with my employees?my company makes me front thousands of dollars on my personal credit card { 272 comments }
friend won’t pay my cancellation fee, car alarm disrupts our office, and more by Alison Green on December 4, 2024 I’m on vacation. Here are some past letters that I’m making new again, rather than leaving them to wilt in the archives. 1. My friend/client won’t pay my cancellation fee I have a friend who I met because we both enjoy certain sports. I’ll call him Frank. I only see Frank when I am involved in this sport, but it’s a small community, so everyone knows each other. Because my business caters to this sport and others like it, Frank decided he would like to use my service. And because he is a friend, I gave him a discounted price. My business is appointment based and I can only see one client at a time, so we have a strict 24-hour rescheduling policy. He has cancelled his appointment many times without proper notice, leaving me in a lurch. I explained to him that I am unable to see other clients as I cannot double book my time and not always able to fill the hole in my schedule on short notice. When I confront him about this, he gets very angry and says he is not a “client” (he is “more than that”) and do not treat him as such. He refuses to pay the cancellation fee. Meanwhile, an ex-employee who was fired for insubordination and stealing clients, is siding up to Frank — disparaging my name and my company, all the while trying to steal him as a client. Because of Frank’s flaky nature, I’m not to sure this wouldn’t be a bad thing. The problem is that Frank is very good at certain athletics and is a featured client on our advertising campaign. In addition to that, he knows many people in the sporting community and word gets around. Should I suck it up? Or set a boundary, change my campaign, and let the chips fall as they may? Wow, Frank is being a real a-hole here. Since he’s a friend, he should get to mess up your schedule and cause you to repeatedly lose income? That’s precisely the opposite of how it should be. Any chance you can say to him, “You’re right, you’re a friend. I don’t want this to interfere with our friendship, so I’m going to refer you to another business for this work from now on.” Or if it would go over better if it wasn’t personalized to him, you could say, “I’ve realized it’s too messy to take business from friends, so I have a new policy of referring friends to other providers.” Alternately, you could tell him you’re willing to keep seeing him but need to get payment in advance and can’t book the appointment without that. But yeah, it sounds like losing him as a client would be a good thing. It also might be a good idea to change the advertising campaign that features him, if that’s not a huge pain — or at least to be prepared to do it if he gets more difficult. – 2019 Read an update to this letter here. 2. A car alarm is disrupting our office many times per hour My office is small, one story, and located on a relatively busy street. There is a car that parks along the street directly in front our our building, and this car has a VERY sensitive car alarm. This has always been an issue since I started here, almost three years ago. The owner of said car previously used to have a car where the alarm system blared every single time a car would zip by. It didn’t matter if it was a smart car or a 4×4 lifted diesel truck, that alarm would go off. Every. Single. Time. Now, she has a different car, with an even more obnoxious car alarm. Sometimes it takes her 2-5 minutes to walk outside the building and turn it off, and it often happens nearly every 5-10 minutes. This is maddening. We are unable to hear clients on phone calls and unable to focus on work because her car alarm is blaring for what seems like hours, every 10 minutes. It is so bad, we have two clients that refuse to meet in our office, which is an issue because of the nature of our work. The reason that we don’t know what to do is that this car does not belong to one of our employees. It belongs to someone in the next door office. I have suggested calling next door and requesting the employee park across the street in the communal lot, rather than right outside our front door, thinking that if it is located in the lot, it won’t be triggered by street noises. This was shut down because they don’t want to cause any hostile tensions between us and that company. They also believe this will come off as controlling. I have also suggested writing a friendly note and leaving it on her car, letting her know her car alarm is very disruptive to our business and the others on the street. This was also called too aggressive (which, who cares at this point). Aside from it being disruptive and giving me regular headaches, I am positive that this has to be annoying for the owner too. Having to get up from your desk to turn off your car alarm every 5-10 minutes has got to be disruptive and aggravating to her too, so I am really at a loss as to why she even wants to park there knowing she is gonna be pulled away from her desk to turn off the alarm. Do you or your readers have any suggestions? P.S. I decided to track the alarm and how long it blasts each time it goes off. In the last 49 minutes, her car alarm has gone off seven times. Since it takes her so long to turn off the alarm, the alarm has been blasting for a combined 28 minutes. I am losing it. Good lord, how is this woman okay with going outside leaving seven times in an hour to turn a car alarm? How is her employer okay with it? I do not understand this situation. In any case, leave the note. You don’t need your employer’s permission to leave the note, as long as you don’t identify your company in it. Leave a note saying you work nearby, the alarm is giving you headaches and driving away clients, and beg her to disable the alarm (which clearly isn’t serving any function at this point) or try parking in the lot. That said, this is not someone who is governed by logic, so the note may make no difference. Your other, and perhaps better, option is to report it to your local police. Many cities will cite car owners whose alarms go off too frequently. – 2019 Read updates to this letter here and here. 3. Coworker’s son comes to work and has bad bathroom etiquette I have a question that I hope will be funny for you and your readers despite the abject horror it has caused me and my colleagues. A C-suite person in our (small, 15-person) office occasionally brings her 12-year-old son to work with her due to childcare issues. My coworkers and I have no problem with this and are all very sympathetic to the plight of working parents. However, there is a major issue: the son regularly pees with the bathroom door wide open (not just one or two inches ajar). We have a single occupancy bathroom on this floor, which is shared by eight colleagues. The other workers are on another floor. Not only does he pee loudly and with the door open, but he frequently misses the toilet, leaves pee on the seat/floor, and doesn’t wash his hands. I know this because, sadly, my desk is right near the bathroom. We put a sign in the bathroom imploring all to wipe the seat if needed, but that doesn’t stop the son. The mother is known to be petty and vindictive, and HR is very hands-off. What to do? The next time you see him going in the bathroom, say, “Cyril, please shut the door when you use the bathroom here.” Handle it just like you’d handle “Cyril, don’t run in the halls here” or “don’t throw those papers all over the place.” You might need to say it repeatedly until it sticks. Until then, if he’s in there with the door wide open, someone should walk over and close the door. You can do the same with the mess: “Hey, you left a mess in here. Please come back and clean it up.” Every time. This will require you and your coworkers paying attention when he’s just left the bathroom but it sounds like it’s warranted. In normal circumstances, you’d ask his mother to handle all of this, but since you describe her as petty and vindictive, you’re probably better off just dealing with it directly. Alternately, it’s reasonable to tell HR they need to intervene (the fact that they’re hands-off doesn’t necessarily mean they won’t, especially if you push hard enough) — but the fastest path here is just to tell Cyril directly what he needs to change. (And if you have any worries the mom will complain, let your manager and/or HR know ahead of time you’re planning to handle it yourselves so they’ve got that context before they hear from her.) – 2019 Read an update to this letter here. 4. IT guy remotely accessed my laptop when I asked him not to Today at work I was experiencing some technical issues, and raised a ticket with our IT support team who are based in another location. Later in the day, I was having a VERY busy hour when a member of the team instant messaged me in response to the ticket. I told him that it was a really bad time and asked if we could look at the issue a bit later, but he remotely accessed my computer anyway! (As in, he could see my screen and had taken over control of its function.) Am I in the wrong for feeling like this out of order? Not only was it a bad time, but I actually had my online banking open in my browser which I would have preferred to have kept private. And what if I had been halfway through a presentation with an important client?! On the other hand, I guess his job is to fix things — not to wait on a time that’s convenient for me, and I suppose I have no right to any real privacy on a company computer. I don’t know — I’m torn! What do you think? I’m with you. If he absolutely had to do it right then because of his own schedule, he should have said something like, “This is the only time I’ll be able to look at it this week — okay for me to go ahead or would you rather wait until next week?” As you pointed out, not only does this raise privacy issues (and sure, you don’t have real privacy on a work computer, but you’re still entitled to at least say, “Hold on, let me close my banking info”), but it could have been far more disruptive to your work than waiting would have been to his (like if you were presenting to a client, or dealing with a work crisis, or so forth). – 2018 You may also like:my client won't pay my cancellation fee, company asked us to donate a kidney to a board member, and moremy employee relocated and didn't tell meI'm caught in the middle of an investigation at work { 164 comments }
updates: reported a coworker for hitting a child, the spooky question, and more by Alison Green on December 3, 2024 It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. Here are five updates from past letter-writers. 1. I reported a coworker for hitting a child (#2 at the link) I figured out after doing some more research that he was actually not a current employee, although his LinkedIn made it seem that way. So I didn’t inform my employer at first. However, several months later I got called to testify in court, and he ended up being sentenced for hitting the child based on my testimony (but not for shoving me, that part never made it into the indictment, which I am totally fine with). About six months later, when I was walking to work, he suddenly showed up and confronted me in front of my office. So at that point, I got my employer’s security involved and informed my boss and we ended up having extra security for a while. He never showed up again at my work. But I do see him around town and unfortunately we run in the same circles in a particular hobby that our kids share, so that has led to having to have some strategies to stay safe and unfortunately my kids and I can’t participate in certain activities around that hobby. What I took away from this is that anything that happens to you in a small town can end up being an issue at work! 2. My employee says he’s “already thought of” every suggestion I make The short update: I didn’t say anything to my employee. The longer update: Your advice and the advice from the forum were incredibly helpful in getting me to see that I was at least as likely to be doing something wrong as my employee and why. Just writing the letter and seeing how seriously you all took it made me feel validated — that his behavior WAS annoying and problematic. But once I had it off my chest, I decided to change my behavior instead of asking him to change his. Maybe I chickened out, but I didn’t feel good about bringing it up directly with him. Instead, over these months, I have focused on letting him have time to think through a process thoroughly and to ask for his plan rather than jumping right into telling him what to do or how to do it better. By taking myself out of his planning or production process, I have shown him that he has ownership and my trust. And to his credit, he’s stepped up. While he still doesn’t do everything as I would, and there are still times when I will make suggestions, he’s been much more receptive to them and far less likely to come back with, “Yep, I was already thinking about doing that.” In the past year, our organization suffered a significant crisis that required us to expand our skills into new and frightening territory. We had each other’s backs throughout the ordeal. That experience cemented our trust, and he’s more confident about fully inhabiting his role. Others at our organization have commented that he seems more productive and engaged. So, I was the problem all along. Sigh. But seriously, thanks, Alison, and thanks to the readers for giving me space to work out the problem and giving me great advice. Sign me: A better manager now. 3. The spooky question It’s brought me great joy that you enjoyed the tale of me asking my coworker if she had ever seen a dead body so much that you published it two years in a row! I know mine was a Mortification Week submission and not a regular question, but I have an update for you! At the time of the story, I was working in an agency, and I was young and new and desperate for people to like me, so I was trying to make any conversation I could. Most of the women in that office were very cliquey (like, nine people wearing the same outfit in one day), and I was very much the outsider. Today, I’m a lot more secure in myself and happier! I also (and this is what made me think to write in) work at a hospital now! Yesterday, five separate people told me about their experiences with dead bodies, unprompted. I don’t know that that’s a good or bad thing, but I’m not only NOT an outsider here, I’m well-liked and in a leadership position! I definitely am slower to speak though, and I’m not desperate to make conversation or friends. 4. AI attending meetings (#2 at the link) Thank you for your response to my question about an AI notetaker unexpectedly appearing in a meeting — it was really helpful in helping me think about why I was uncomfortable with the AI notetaker and what sort of rules we might have around them. As it turned out, the person who was using the AI notetaker didn’t realize it was attending all their Zoom meetings. And this did prompt my team to have a discussion about how to deal with AI notetakers; we now boot them when we see they’re in meetings, and check with the person identified as the “owner” of the notetaker. (I think in every case, they’ve been unaware the bot was attending for them.) We’re also working on a new notetaker policy, because it feels important that these meetings remain a space where people feel they can talk openly. 5. How do I not lose hope in a highly competitive field? Thank you so much for answering my letter so many years ago. This is an update to the question I wrote during a very fraught time in my life. I continued my search for the academic job well into the pandemic. However, the sudden loss of all work in 2020 nevertheless forced me (as it no doubt did others) to seriously reevaluate my life and priorities. I became aware that what I had been trying to do was simply not sustainable, neither physically nor mentally. In response to Alison’s “can you do this for ten more years” question, I finally realized the answer was “no.” I began to cast my net for a much broader range of jobs. Two years into the pandemic, I was hired for a directorship at a firm across the country. It was far from my home network and, though it let me remain in my field, it was not something I really ever imagined myself doing. But it turns out I am not only good at the work — I enjoy it! Ironically, as soon as I was hired for this firm, a university in the area reached out to me to teach some classes there. It seems that my new industry job gave me credentials that were attractive for teaching! I don’t teach full time, but I actually really enjoy the variety of my life. I have a job that I like and keeps me comfortable, and I get to enjoy teaching the wonderful students at this school without the pressures of a full-time professorship. Life isn’t perfect — in my field, I will never be rich, and my job is high pressure and public. My teaching contract is per-semester, so I also know that I’m not guaranteed to be able to keep doing it. I’m still far busier than is healthy, and I crave a better work-life balance. Even so, I feel very lucky to be employed doing work I love, and I don’t think it would have been possible to do that without doing some letting go. I’m also working with a therapist on creating better boundaries with my work and personal life, and have made good progress addressing my achievement/self-worth issues that some commenters astutely read between the lines of my original letter. I really appreciated your gentle but forthright advice. I also appreciated the empathy of the comments, though some were hard to read. A few people felt that I had expressed entitlement, classism, or gendered expectations by my word choices, and that hurt; but I can see why I came across that way. My field is deeply male-dominated and I think that the past few years have opened my eyes both to the internal and external effects of that on others and on myself. I am beginning to see that that environment compounded my need to prove my worth in an unhealthy way. I’ve recently become involved in some organizations that strive to make my field friendlier and more welcoming, especially to my fellow women and nonbinary colleagues. This has been incredibly fulfilling and healing, and I am trying to learn as much as I can so I can strive to be as good a role model as I can for my students. I sort of wish I could go back and tell a younger me that the perfect/most prestigious job is not the most important thing in the world; that there are so many facets of life that make it worth living, and that those facets are deeply personal. I think exploring what I truly wanted out of life beyond my career would have saved me a lot of grief and pain—and time. That said, in some ways I think I had to go through this to come to this point, which is of course still evolving. Thank you again for publishing my letter, and to everyone for their kind insights. You may also like:interviewer asked what brings me pain, I reported a coworker for hitting a child, and morewhat's reasonable for managers to expect of parents working from home?my boss expects me to babysit her rambunctious kid { 47 comments }
updates: best friend is dating my employee, coworker tries to scare me, and more by Alison Green on December 3, 2024 It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. Here are four updates from past letter-writers. There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day. 1. My best friend is dating my employee Your advice was to talk to the employee, because a bit of atypically personal interaction was warranted given how much the employee had to lose. So I did. I reiterated that I didn’t expect my friend to tell me anything so she could talk freely to him, and that while I’ve been his friend through numerous breakups and he’s never turned into a weird stalker/aggressive guy, if he did in this case I’d throw him out the same as anyone else. She said pretty much what he did, that she assumed none of that was going to be a problem, but that it was still good to hear it from me. I also had a talk with our one middle manager-type employee, saying I was aware there might be an appearance of favoritism and I was guarding against that, but an extra set of eyes looking out for the same problem was welcome. She never mentioned it again, so I don’t think anyone came to her with concerns. Some commentators wondered about banning these types of relationships, but that’s just not feasible in a small town nor in a bar environment, and certainly not in both. Another wondered about sexism in your response, but I thought that was nonsense. Long story short (too late), we did go on one trip together and while it wasn’t 100% awkward free, it was short and fun and not an issue. And the main issue became moot when she quit (for good reasons: she was working for me as a second job to clear some debt, and once her finances improved she wanted more free time, which I totally respect). She and my friend are still dating, quite seriously, and we’ve gone on a couple short trips together that haven’t had any awkwardness. She did hint a few months later about asking to rejoin our team a bit, and I demurred. I had several reasons, but one was that I didn’t want to reopen the issue. I worried about whether that was fair to her or not, but ultimately there were other factors at play (we didn’t really need another staff member, mostly). She and I are becoming friends, despite starting with a different relationship, and things are good. I’m really glad I wrote in and you answered. It took an issue that hadn’t been a problem but that I thought might become one, and made it a total non-issue. Thanks for the good advice. 2. My boss is upset that I quit without more notice because I’m vital to the business I did not realize just how toxic working for Amanda was until I started this new job. As some readers speculated, my letter was just the surface of the dysfunction. This was my first long term job in the professional world and I now realize how many red flags I ignored. This whole process has been like bad relationship/break-up. Amanda reached out to me a few times after I left with questions. I answered at first but after a rude reply from her, I blocked her number. She had to hire two positions to replace me and, from what I have heard, she has had a hard time keeping the positions filled. I feel bad for leaving her in that situation but I also understand that she is one who created that work environment and it is no longer my responsibility. My new job is amazing. It’s a night and day difference. I start at 9 am and I am done at 5 pm most days. I am not expected to be constantly accessible by phone. Most importantly, I no longer feel like I am drowning at work. I have PTO and a healthy work-life balance is highly encouraged. And in the happiest news, my fiance (who encouraged me to leave) and I are just a few weeks from the wedding! I am taking almost two weeks off for the wedding/honeymoon and, hopefully, for the first time I won’t spend my time off checking in on and worrying about the office. 3. My coworker thinks it’s funny to try to scare me I wanted to write in and give an update about the coworker who enjoyed scaring me. It feels like such a scandalous update compared to how bland my problem was but here goes. So I did get him to stop startling me, at least on purpose. I will say I probably wasn’t as assertive as I could’ve been, looking back at it all these years later. But I asked him to stop and he stopped. I’ll still jump at innocent coworkers’ friendly hellos, but at the very least I’m just startled and not both startled and pissed. I remember some comments not understanding the difference between being startled on accident vs being startled on purpose and to that I say it’s the same thing as being tripped on accident vs being tripped on purpose. Both irritating, but one is usually followed by apologies and laughs and the other is rude. But in the end, during Covid work-from-home, he was fired for asking another colleague for topless photos. 4. Is it unprofessional to ask to change desks because you don’t like someone? I planned not to say anything until management told me who my new mentor would be, but it turns out I didn’t need to say anything. Today they pulled me aside and told me they’d picked a new mentor, and asked if I’d like to move my cubicle to be across the aisle from him, so I said yes. Thank you for your advice, I’m glad I let the situation work itself out. You may also like:most popular posts of 2020most popular posts of 2018when your teenager dates your boss’s son and it goes bad { 97 comments }
updates: the dog-sitter, coworker is taking credit for my work, and more by Alison Green on December 3, 2024 It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. Here are four updates from past letter-writers. There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day. 1. My neighbor, her nephew, my kid, and her dogs I have a bit of an update on a situation I shared a few months ago, regarding my 13-year-old son Falcon dog-sitting for our neighbor. I had been feeling quite guilty about how everything went down. Thank you to you, Alison, and the commenters for stating that Falcon was under no obligation to return the dog-sitting money. He went above and beyond in the care he provided to the dogs and he rightfully earned that money. I want to reassure everyone that I paid Falcon back his full fee. I offered to refund part of the money to Jane because she was upset, and more so because her husband seemed irate. As several commenters pointed out, these people are neighbors with whom we cross paths often. Jane is also a gossip. In the heat of the moment, I was trying to protect us from reputational harm. Falcon mows lawns and waters plants for a few of our neighbors in the summer, and I was concerned he’d lose those opportunities. All of this occurred shortly before school started. I walk my dog much earlier in the morning during the school year to ensure I get Falcon out the door and myself to work on time. As a result, I’ve only bumped into Jane a couple of times since the dog-sitting incident. I’ve maintained a professionally friendly demeanor with her, but I no longer go out of my way to chat. She seems the same as always, so I suppose that’s good. She hasn’t requested Falcon’s help with anything since the incident, and I’m not sure she will again. Falcon doesn’t seem bothered by any of it anymore. While I don’t think he’d accept another dog-sitting job from her, he’s still open to doing so for others. Thank you to everyone who responded and for the concern you showed for Falcon. 2. My coworker is taking credit for my work when she applies for jobs I spoke with my manager about what was going on, and although I wasn’t privy to the discussion he had with “Bella,” my work was removed from her portfolio a little while later. Her new job is in a completely different industry. I’d like to think that word got around about her behavior, but I think it’s more likely that she realized she just doesn’t enjoy this kind of work. Happily, I’ve also found that since Bella left I’ve been more confident in general, and it shows in my work. I now have plenty of new, stronger pieces to add to my portfolio — and it’s a huge relief to know that nobody else is claiming credit for them. I really appreciate the advice from you and your readers. I’d been stuck in this horrible working relationship for so long that I almost believed what was happening to me was normal and not worth kicking up a fuss about. All your advice was brilliant, but what I really needed was for someone to tell me my feelings about the situation were completely valid. 3. My job wants me to find coverage after I quit (#3 at the link) I replied to my manager’s email and asked if I would be looking for coverage during my next shift. He told me no, I needed to complete my normal work tasks because the upcoming week would be busy. I politely informed him that, if this was the case, I would not be able to find coverage and would still be leaving on my last day. He stressed how busy they would be during the week after my last day and that they needed as many people to come in. I didn’t reply again, and that was the last interaction I had with this manager. I have since moved, and I now have a job that pays better and has a far healthier employee culture! Thanks for the advice! It saved me a lot of stress. 4. A conversation about kittens led to a lecture from HR Wow, it’s strange to think back to the time when that conversation was the only problem I’d had with Joan. I took your advice and gave the context to HR, who implied that they weren’t surprised to hear this about her. Joan and I have both worked for the company for a few years, but we had been on hybrid schedules without overlapping days until she changed her schedule this year. I didn’t know her well at all, but HR clearly did. I am honestly just a quiet, shy, people pleasing person who likes cats, but somehow Joan decided that I, as a cat-lover, was her nemesis. The more she hated me, the more other people responded to her like she was in the wrong, and the more she doubled down. Here are some highlights: She was often reading this book in the breakroom and fake-laughing to draw attention to it. A friend made me cookies for my birthday and I brought the excess ones to work — they were homemade but not in my home. Joan still called them “urine cookies.” My coworkers ate them with exaggerated relish while saying “mmm, delicious urine.” She made a point of sanitizing any surface she saw me touch (even wiping down the microwave between when I put my food in and when I got it out). I’m not the only cat owner in the office so she wasn’t protecting herself from cat germs very effectively. She asked at a staff meeting whether the dress code could be updated to state that pet fur on clothing was unprofessional, and was told no. People gift me a lot of cat-themed things, and I have several cat mugs. The one I used in the office got “accidentally” broken while I was working from home. So I brought another cat mug in, it got broken too. A third mug, the same thing (I had a lot of mugs). A coworker found some enamel (unbreakable) cat mugs in a dollar shop and bought 10 of them to put in the office cupboard. Joan complained to HR that she was being bullied, which HR dismissed. I don’t need this kind of drama in my life so I spoke to my boss about going fully remote and it was approved. Now I spend every workday with a pile of kittens on my lap. Thanks Joan! And thank you for your advice! Kitten tax attached. You may also like:a dog-sitting job gone bad, delayed approval for time off, and morea coworker is harassing my neighbor (who is having chemo)can I ask my coworkers why they didn’t hire my daughter? { 218 comments }
I feel exploited by my employees by Alison Green on December 3, 2024 A reader writes: I lead a manufacturing business that I co-founded over a decade ago. It turned its first profit recently, but all this time, we as the owners have taken care of everyone by taking colossal personal debt and making incredible sacrifices, including working ourselves an average of 60 hours a week. We have always managed to pay our staff on time and to increase wages and benefits gradually even when the business was faring pretty badly, insulating them from our woes. We try to personally support employees and to make sure they feel secure, keep growing and that the culture stays safe, healthy, and dynamic. We also make a deliberate effort to observe the unwritten rules of “bosshood.” We stayed silent when a disgruntled ex-employee was badmouthing us around town. We ignore the occasional unfair online review, take on the feedback, and hope that the other reviews will balance out the story. We settle final pay cheerfully and promptly for employees who have delivered no value we can detect. We bend over backwards to place star employees we cannot keep. In short, the company aims to keep the moral high ground, no matter what. But frankly, I feel exhausted and exploited. I don’t expect kudos. But how about mere professionalism and reciprocal human decency? It seems to me that the culture fails to acknowledge employees can be bullies who victimize employers. Who decided that the employee is always right? Don’t both sides have responsibility to be fair, sane, and cordial? Where does my responsibility as a “good” employer start and end? Please help me make sense of this. I answer this question over at Inc. today, where I’m revisiting letters that have been buried in the archives here from years ago (and sometimes updating/expanding my answers to them). You can read it here. You may also like:should people who sell MLM products put "business owner" on their resumes?am I too generous with my employees?how can I hire people when my company won't negotiate on salary or remote work? { 186 comments }
update: can I do anything about my aggressive-driver coworker? by Alison Green on December 3, 2024 It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day. Remember the letter-writer asking if she could do anything about an aggressive-driver coworker (#2 at the link)? Here’s the update. I truly didn’t imagine there would be an update, because “let this one go” seemed like the right call. But in early October, I ended up filing a police report about this driver after he tailgated me up two floors of our parking garage repeatedly screaming “fuck you” because [checks notes] my gate opened before his and I tried to follow the right of way by going first. I also filed a complaint with HR, because screaming obscenities at people is pretty clearly against our code of conduct. (If you ever find yourself in this situation, apparently the most relevant legal detail turned out to be that I tried to pull over and let him pass, but he continued to tailgate me and scream.) But best of all, I found a different route to work that only takes me a minute or two longer and ensures we don’t cross paths! I was really hesitant to report, but the campus police handled it well, and I was asked what I wanted out of reporting in a way that gave me agency over the process. (I know reading “what do you want out of this” feels kind of aggro, but the tone was, “because we want to help make that happen.”) I told them I just wanted someone to impress upon this guy that traffic laws apply to him and he isn’t invisible or invincible. An officer spoke to him at work about what was officially a “road rage incident,” and there are now regular speed checks at the point where his behavior was most egregious. A quick note for other people in this situation: I wish I had reported him much sooner! With the caveat that campus police are probably able to have different priorities than city police, the officer I worked with really impressed on me that I don’t have to wait until someone is actively screaming at me to call — repeated reckless driving along the same route is something they are very willing to post officers about! Also, I know this is already long, but I want to call out my manager for really having my back here. I was planning to just lodge an HR complaint, and he gently reiterated that this behavior deserved a more serious response than opening a ticket. I hesitated, and he immediately offered me his office if I needed a private place to make the call. That was exactly the right move, not least because I hadn’t even consciously realized part of my hesitation about calling was that, from my desk, all of my coworkers would hear all of my business, and I was still feeling pretty shaken up. Just a small but concrete thing he did that really made a difference for me, and something I hope other managers with private offices will keep in their back pockets when they have direct reports in cubes. You may also like:my coworker is a terrible driver -- and I have to ride with him on work tripsmy new employee ran a background check on me and asked me about what he foundI caught my coworker masturbating at his desk { 127 comments }